Timur - Founder of the Timurid Empire

[vinod2070]

Originally Posted by A1Kaid

All that did was delay progress for Turks, Turks manage to recover quickly (due to great government structure and organization) and actually went onto expand for hundreds of more years.


Timur was simply a bump in the road, if you look at Ottoman history at a whole. Again Timur simply delayed progress did not stop it.

In fact Timurs empire later fell after his battle with the Turks, Timurids vanished but Ottoman went to live on

It also gave time for the Europeans to regroup and the Turks were finally stopped at the gates of Vienna. After that it was only retreat for them. They inevitably became the sick man of Europe that just needed a push to crumble.

And crumble they did, even though it took some time in coming.

[vinod2070]

due to great government structure and organization

What great government structure you are talking about? Many Turk Caliphs were mentally sick and extremely cruel due to all their childhood and much of their manhood spent in closed doors with no interaction allowed with anyone. Once they became Caliph, they would lock up anyone who could challenge them or murder them to become the ruler.

The Turkish rule is known for its brutality in the areas it ruled, especially in Europe. The Bosnian genocide had its roots in that Ottoman rule and its bitter memories still prevail in East Europe.

They even snatched kids from their parents and used them to persecute their own people! How sick?

[A1Kaid]

Originally Posted by vinod2070

It also gave time for the Europeans to regroup and the Turks were finally stopped at the gates of Vienna. After that it was only retreat for them. They inevitably became the sick man of Europe that just needed a push to crumble.

And crumble they did, even though it took some time in coming.

Regroup? No it did not, your history time line and reason is inaccurate. The Turks being stopped at Vienna, has nothing to do with Timurs attack on Ottoman which was more than a hundred years before the battle of Vienna. In fact Ottoman empire wasn't weaken by Timur.

Being stopped at Vienna could have been prevented whether European armies regrouped or not. Reasons for Ottoman stopping at Vienna are different and unrelated.


You are falsely attributing things here.

[A1Kaid]

Originally Posted by vinod2070

What great government structure you are talking about? Many Turk Caliphs were mentally sick and extremely cruel due to all their childhood and much of their manhood spent in closed doors with no interaction allowed with anyone. Once they became Caliph, they would lock up anyone who could challenge them or murder them to become the ruler.

The Turkish rule is known for its brutality in the areas it ruled, especially in Europe. The Bosnian genocide had its roots in that Ottoman rule and its bitter memories still prevail in East Europe.

They even snatched kids from their parents and used them to persecute their own people! How sick?

You read history by bs sources. What you are saying is false.

Ottomans also believed in ruling over non-Muslims with a "light touch" the people were allowed to keep their faith.


I understand you are so keen to are Turks stopped and defeated by Europeans.

I doubt Europeans were keen to see aggression or war against Hind and your pagan people stopped at all, they could careless.

[vinod2070]

Originally Posted by A1Kaid

Regroup? No it did not, your history time line and reason is inaccurate. The Turks being stopped at Vienna, has nothing to do with Timurs attack on Ottoman which was more than a hundred years before the battle of Vienna. In fact Ottoman empire wasn't weaken by Timur.

Being stopped at Vienna could have been prevented whether European armies regrouped or not. Reasons for Ottoman stopping at Vienna are different and unrelated.


You are falsely attributing things here.

I know there was a time lag. I never said otherwise.

However, Timur did cause significant loss to the Turks. Turks were considered the scourge of God in Europe. They were feared as cruel barbarians, just like mongols were in the Islamic world.

I have read historians say that Timur's attack helped stop the Turks in Europe. You want to believe otherwise, fine with me. Its not a big issue.

In that case the Timur bugger was totally worthless shyt.

[vinod2070]

Originally Posted by A1Kaid

You read history by bs sources. What you are saying is false.

What is false? The cruel nature of many Turkish Sultans?

The fact that many of them were hopeless drunkards? That they were kept locked in windowless rooms for much of their life till the existing Caliph died? That it was because they could not trust their own brothers and sons not to butcher them for power? That this isolated life for many years made many of them schizophrenic? That many of them were womanizers? That a Turkish Caliph ordered a boatload of women to be killed just because their chatter disturbed him?

You need to read on the Turkish Sultans more in that case.

Ottomans also believed in ruling over non-Muslims with a "light touch" the people were allowed to keep their faith.

Of course, slave taking on a massive scale, snatching their kids to persecute them is all light touch!

I am sure you will be happy to have the same light touch now being applied to Muslims all over. Starting with Afghans and Iraqis?

Anyway, the Afghans and Iraqis have been allowed to keep their faith. So I believe you are happy with their occupation by USA.

I understand you are so keen to are Turks stopped and defeated by Europeans.

This is history we are talking about! You seem to be missing the context completely.

The Turks were stopped and defeated. Now they are trying to be accepted in the same Europe. They don't want to be a part of the Arab/Islamic world. they want to look forward, not back.

I doubt Europeans were keen to see aggression or war against Hind and your pagan people stopped at all, they could careless.

I could care less what they care about or not. We pushed back our aggressors on our own strength.

[A1Kaid]

We're not going to agree on these matters, okay? Let's just leave it at that. This also goes for the Pak-writing thread as well.

[vinod2070]

I am just presenting facts. One is free to counter it or not.

[pronky]

is it authenticated

[A1Kaid]

Originally Posted by pronky

is it authenticated

Lol! That's a damn good question.





Answer is obviously no. Lol